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- Current Strawhat Crew vs. Raditz, Nappa, and Vegeta(Read OP)
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| Current Strawhat Crew vs. Raditz, Nappa, and Vegeta(Read OP) | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Apr 1 2018, 02:27 AM (825 Views) | |
| Dankness Lava | Apr 1 2018, 02:27 AM Post #1 |
Dankness Forever
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The crew gets to use all their powers without tiring out. That means all forms of Haki, any devil fruit ability, etc. The trio can not do anything that would cause an instant win like blowing up the planet. No Great Ape. I don't think I need to explain why. If they win, they then go against Cui, Dodoria, and Zarbon. Zarbon can transform if necessary. Cui can use dirty tactics. Dodoria is bloodlusted. Edited by Dankness Lava, Apr 1 2018, 02:28 AM.
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| PocketGod | Apr 1 2018, 02:29 AM Post #2 |
 
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Raditz b*** slaps them all with his tail while Nappa and Vegeta watch. |
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| Dankness Lava | Apr 1 2018, 04:47 AM Post #3 |
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Dankness Forever
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Haki, Gear Forms, and Gum Gum abilities mean nothing here? |
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| + Steve | Apr 1 2018, 07:48 AM Post #4 |
Greetings. I will be your waifu this season.
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I'm not sure about Vegeta but they could beat the other two, none of them are as physically strong as Luffy, not even close. Even just with this. And in Gear Fourth, which has no time limit by these rules, Luffy can do that over and over and nothing but Ki blasts will do anything to him. Or he can use his new Snake Man form to be wildly unpredictable and much faster. And then there's Zoro who can cut a near mountain sized dude in to three sections easily, just by using a bit of Haki. He has some pretty excellent range and he's fast. Sanji is pretty tough as well and can basically fly, Raditz shouldn't be a major challenge especially not when he can use Observation Haki for almost precog. As can Luffy, though his is slightly more complex. The rest of the crew is cannon fodder, maybe they'd take pity on Nami for being weak and not attack her and she could get some lightning going but it takes a while. Usopp might have some useful Pop Greens, maybe he has one that releases sleep gas or poison, probably sleep if anything. There's no way Raditz and Nappa beat the big three, they're complete dumbasses and would insist they can take them all alone. |
 Definitely not a succubus, fear not | |
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| Darker | Apr 1 2018, 08:02 AM Post #5 |
The Lord of the Dark
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"But Steeeve!!!! Raditz alone stopped a moon busting beam with his hand!!!!" Just gonna post this here so that others don't have to, because I know they will. This will stop the conversation from going further than it should be. |
 Piccolo: Just how many people have you sacrificed?! Cell: Sacrifice? Hmph, rubbish! On the contrary, it is an honor to become a fraction of my power. | |
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| PocketGod | Apr 1 2018, 08:04 AM Post #6 |
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Pretty much, Raditz is so far above them in every stat that none of those abilities would help much at all. |
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| + PocketGoggu | Apr 1 2018, 08:16 AM Post #7 |
Royal Guard.
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What has Raditz shown to have above them? |
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Noice sig from Sushi Nyah
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| Notaka | Apr 1 2018, 09:15 AM Post #8 |
Always Wright
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Glad you did it. When someone in One Piece can punch and break the moon I'll give them the win. Though it's not enough. That point has to be EMPHASIZED.
For starters, he's way, way faster. He can dodge a beam that reaches the moon within seconds. One Piece doesn't really have a feat that compares to it. His attack potency is multitudes of level higher. He's a "moon buster", even if Darker already pointed that, but that alone should suffice. In OP, arguably the strongest character is "Planet Level" by hyperbole. But the dude is most likely Country level, or at the very, very max Continent level. @Steve Do you really still believe that bogus split durability theory ? Even when I presented proof? If yes, I'm sorry but I'd rather not fall for that. Let me say one thing though: Luffy's precog is gonna be nearly useless against the likes of Raditz and Nappa. Sure he can see the future, but that didn't stop Katakuri, a way more experienced Observation Haki user, from being hit by Luffy's attacks. And that attack is as slow as a snail compared to what Raditz and Nappa can dish out. I'll say they could probably beat Raditz due to their implacable team work, but Nappa just straights murders them just by lifting two fingers. And don't say he's "too dumb to do it", it's literally the first thing he did when he crash landed with Vegeta on that city. Edited by Notaka, Apr 1 2018, 09:20 AM.
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 "My name is Kakyoin Noriaki!" Thanks to Graffiti for the Sig!  | |
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| Darker | Apr 1 2018, 09:43 AM Post #9 |
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The Lord of the Dark
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You completely ignored the point of my post. The point is that it doesn't matter if split durability is a thing, the point is that DB characters, especially from the era these three are from, are way too damn inconsistent. Their power is measured through "he's stronger than X guy" statements, not actual decent or reasonable feats, which DB as a whole lacks. One Piece, on the other hand, doesn't. The point of my post is that these types of debates just post. It makes DB characters look poor and idiotic alongside anyone who tries to reason their showings and it doesn't make it fun for the other side (One Piece in this case) that is trying to compete with something that quite literally doesn't make sense from a feats standpoint. |
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Piccolo: Just how many people have you sacrificed?! Cell: Sacrifice? Hmph, rubbish! On the contrary, it is an honor to become a fraction of my power. | |
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| Notaka | Apr 1 2018, 09:58 AM Post #10 |
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Always Wright
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Fair enough. I don't know what to say, since you hit the nail on the top. Though I'll ask this: Is being inconsistent of any relevance here ? We get that DBZ chars are horribly inconsistent. "He's stronger than X guy" is still a valid argument, especially when said "X guy" actually demonstrated feats. |
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"My name is Kakyoin Noriaki!" Thanks to Graffiti for the Sig! | |
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| + Steve | Apr 1 2018, 10:15 AM Post #11 |
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Greetings. I will be your waifu this season.
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Got any scans of Dragon Ball characters doing that you'd like to add...?
Except Luffy dodging lasers, which if I remember right were fired at the back of his head. Must have remembered another time he dodged something like that but yeah there you go, he doesn't even look at them when he dodges and he's not even remotely powered up there. If you want to go in to all this bulls*** about DBZ characters being light speed so early, I can do the same bulls*** with Luffy. Kizaru is literally made of light, so by all this astounding logic, everyone who keeps up with him or dodges any of his attacks is light level too. Focusing on outliers backfires when other series have them too.
Yes, because it's so clearly real but you'll be damned if anyone can feasibly hurt precious Dragon Ball characters. Ki blows up planets. Punches do not. Punches still hurt people. Split durability, if every attack had the force of a Ki blast then the environmental destruction would be astounding and you have to invent all sorts of magical powers to justify that not happening, none of which are ever presented by the story. Why is it that whenever someone wants to destroy the planet, they go for a Ki blast? Again, if you have any scans of moon level punches so early in the series, I'm very interested in them.
Straight bulls*** really, that attack wouldn't kill them. It levelled a city, cool. The Strawhats survived Ursus Shock pre-timeskip after fighting for ages and mostly being on the brink of death. And then you have other characters like Pell who survive colossal explosions. One Piece characters have insane endurance, an attack like that ain't killing them, there's nothing special about it besides it's range. And again bulls***, there's no way Nappa would do that against actual opponents, that's a fundamental misunderstanding of his character. Like he was going to waste his time on a city full of 5's. Dudes literally a pure blood Saiyan, he's just going to b*** out and not fight these guys? Come on. Edited by Steve, Apr 1 2018, 10:17 AM.
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Definitely not a succubus, fear not | |
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| Notaka | Apr 1 2018, 10:44 AM Post #12 |
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Always Wright
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There aren't, sadly. Unless you want to see feats from Super, which includes planet busting with kicks and punches. Though that isn't relevant to this discussion. However the point I'm making, is that One Piece's attack potency is far below DB's.
Are they light speed lasers? They took some time to hit the tree behind him, whereas Piccolo's blast reached the moon literally with 2-3 seconds.
Powered up ? What does that mean ? He's not a DBZ character so he can't suppress his strength.
Kizaru is only light speed when traveling. There's no proof saying the opposite, especially when he's tagged by characters like Rayleigh. And nobody is saying DBZ characters are "light speed", just that they're way faster than OP chars. Just because you're made of light(Which Kizaru isn't, he can just turn into light and still has a physical body) doesn't mean you're going to be as fast as it.
Such as? Give me examples of One Piece outliers and I'll gladly debunk them for you.
No it isn't, Really. It's never implied in the show, guidebooks state the opposite, saying that physical bodies have a limit and KI is the way to overcome that. This split durability stems from the fact that DBZ's characters have terrible lifting strength, which doesn't equate to striking strength.
Punches still hurt people... Who can tank a planetary explosion half dead. Therefore their punches(At least Namek arc saga) are stronger than the explosion of a planet. It still applies to Saiyan Saga chars, when they can tank blasts capable of moon-level explosions.
KI control.... They can maximize damage while minimizing collateral damage. Or simply that's an oversight from Toriyama's part. It's why Gohan's kamehameha against Cell's only left a small crater despite it being at the very least planetary, or Vegeta's self destruct attack. Either way, that doesn't prove Split Durability, which isn't implied in the show. If anything, Super has made it clear that their punches are indeed infused with KI, as Goku was destroying planets from the shockwaves made by his and Beerus' fists.
Why wouldn't he ? He'd use the attack, and then whoever survives is worthy of fighting. It would seriously injure them, and destroy easily half the crew. I'd wager only Luffy, Zoro, Sanji, Franky would survive it. Jinbe if he's considered part of the crew. And are you seriously comparing Ursus shock to that attack? Didn't ursus shock attack from the inside ? This is what Nappa can do casually:  Is there any other OP character that can do it by lifting only two fingers ?
Because it does the job BETTER. It's covers more area.
One Piece characters have insane endurance, yet can be killed by gunshots ? When DB chars have been resistant to gun shots from the first episode ? How about this, Why doesn't Raditz or Nappa just grab some random rock and fling it at them? Again with Nappa. What makes you think he'd see them as a viable opponent ? Do you honestly think a couple of hundreds is going to interest him? We could go forever and ever going on this. You're inclined to believe a theory based on the inconsistency of Dragon Ball, I'm not. So I'd rather stop now since nothing ever comes out of these topics. |
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"My name is Kakyoin Noriaki!" Thanks to Graffiti for the Sig! | |
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| + Steve | Apr 1 2018, 11:39 AM Post #13 |
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Greetings. I will be your waifu this season.
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A point which is irrelevant when we're not talking about characters in Super, who are millions of times more powerful. Scale it back and you have no argument there. Simple as that.
It's animated? Animation is slow. Light takes barely over a second to get to the moon, so Piccolo's blast wouldn't be light speed then.
Right about here, the argument should end. Clearly you've done literally no research on One Piece.
There's no proof for most of your claims yet you present them as fact anyway. All I'm doing is arguing the same way you people do. One of Kizaru's moves is called "Light Speed Kick" That's all the vague proof one needs to make absurd claims. If Rayleigh tags him then that just means Rayleigh is light level too, no proof saying he isn't therefore he is, right?
Literally just doing that with the light thing. One Piece characters are obviously not light speed but neither are early Dragon Ball characters unless you want to stretch stuff reeeal far. Which I can do with One Piece, as stated.
Yeahhh and they have terrible striking strength too? None of their punches reflect the amount of damage Ki blasts can do, at all. Ki is always more powerful, because clearly you can put more in to a blast than a punch.
And energy resistance is not the same as physical resistance. Like literally every form of fiction understands this.
Prove it. Why would someone like Buu not just casually punch the planet once and destroy it when he wants to b*** out of a fight, why does he take the time to charge up a blast that can be blocked or countered? Why doesn't a single person blow up a planet with a punch or a kick?
Except that it is because people get damaged by physical hits that are clearly not that powerful, and they're hurt by physical objects or crashing in to the ground, something which shouldn't hurt at all if Ki is so good. Vegeta was weak but why does Yajirobe's katana even slightly damage him? And how the hell does it cut off his tail? Yes, the tail is the weak point but we know they're strong, almost like another arm. It's not like they're weak in that they're as tough as a marshmallow. Doesn't make sense for Yajirobe who's power level was like what apparently 970 compared to Vegeta's 180,000, literally 180 times more powerful and a s***ty presumably steel katana with no Ki in it cuts his flesh.
Yeah, so they have to be as strong as they are in Super to do that. Do you want to compare Power Levels in Super to early DBZ and see how that argument makes no sense?
Come on man this is a complete non-argument. Why didn't he use it against all the Z fighters then? Clearly he scanned them first, why wouldn't he scan the Straw Hats when they're probably the most interesting bunch of creatures he's ever seen? One of them is literally a living skeleton, like he's instantly going to try kill them all. He was introducing them to the Earth when he did that, he obviously knew there was no challenge to be had.
I don't see why it should, it'd injure the weaker members and do nothing to the rest really. I mean again, Ursus Shock. Even Usopp survives that. Usopp also survives being hit by Enel's lightning and I'm pretty sure he's literally stated to be the weakest member of the crew at that point, probably not current crew.
Uhh no? Ursus Shock is a huge shockwave.
Is there a DB character who can do that without Ki?
There is no "better" when you're destroying a planet. If you destroy it you did you job, and you killed everyone in Dragon Ball aside from robots or aliens. If punches and kicks do the same why on Earth does anyone take several seconds or more to charge up a blast when they can just flick a planet and apparently it would be gone. Not sure how anyone thinks that argument has any sort of foundation.
Inconsistency and guns in OP are more of a plot device anyway, they're basically drama pieces. But if you want to use that then, Goku and the standard issue ray gun whilst literally being in God form. Sometimes s*** just don't make sense.
He was interested in a 981 which I'm guessing was Gohan. There's no possible way you could quantify One Piece characters in to power levels unless we presume Haki would give of a Ki-like reading. In which case Luffy ought to give a high reading, since his Conquerors Haki can knock out 50,000 people easily. Plus, literally nobody challenged him in the city, if the Strawhats are challenging him then he's going to accept that challenge, if not just to make a fool of them for doing so. Nappa is a pretty easy character to understand, there's no way he'd do what you say.
Because you lot consistently ignore things and half the time don't even know about whatever series Dragon Ball is facing off against and just regurgitate the same things over and over and ignore any sort of debunk. Edited by Steve, Apr 1 2018, 11:43 AM.
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Definitely not a succubus, fear not | |
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| + PocketGoggu | Apr 1 2018, 11:55 AM Post #14 |
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Royal Guard.
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A concept such as split theory shouldn't be treated as anything more than an interesting theory. The series itself never acknowledges the idea that the fighters power levels are millions of times more powerful for Ki blasts than Ki punches (which wouldn't make much sense even then considering it's the exact same type of energy, powering up the exact same way. The fighters are using Ki to get as powerful as they are, it's a big point for why Goku's so powerful. You wouldn't be magical weaker to the same type of energy.). I would even argue that the series contradicts this idea many times, mostly within the Freeza Arc, during the Raditz V Goku and Piccolo Arc, the Kamehameha only doubled Goku's energy output, and such a fact absolutely blew Raditz's mind away, even the rest of the Freeza Force treated it as a bizarre and powerful ability that they didn't know, expect for Captain Ginyu and Freeza, which was treated as a special fact. And that would imply that the Ki output from their blasts is not much greater than their regular output. Really, it's just a case of Dragon Ball being inconsistent, and solidifying to me that it really shouldn't be pit against any other series outside of itself. Actually, on second thought, if you have to pit Dragon Ball against any other series, keep it to equal power levels so that arguments about power don't spring up. Edited by PocketGoggu, Apr 1 2018, 11:57 AM.
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Noice sig from Sushi Nyah
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| + Steve | Apr 1 2018, 12:18 PM Post #15 |
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Greetings. I will be your waifu this season.
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But they're not the same at all, that's the thing. An energy wave is completely different, has completely different force and velocity to a punch. If it worked like this then they'd basically control their bodies like puppets using Ki, yet clearly they use their muscles to punch. It'd be absurd to say strength isn't a factor in how hard they hit with a punch or a kick, if it wasn't then they ought to be able to do the same damage with a lighthearted slap, since Ki is all that matters here going by that logic. Doesn't matter how sharp a knife is, the hand that's pushing it determines how hard it cuts. Same principle. Ki blasts go above and beyond what physical hits are capable of, which is why everyone uses them.
Wasn't that just because by that point nobody had learned how to suppress or alter their Power Level? Pretty sure that's all that is. When someone gets a 1200 reading on the Scouter it means they're constantly 1200 whereas the Z Fighters could be anything from 4 to 1196. Debates about Dragon Ball vs other series are fine people just refuse to let go of things and come up with ridiculous scenarios to justify a Dragon Ball win, rather than discussing how a fight might go down. How many replies to anything like this are "Raditz speed blitzes instantly" or "Goku instantly murders his opponent"? The answer is most of them. Even though almost all the time, it doesn't make sense. Goku never rushes at people and brutally kills them for no reason. The problem with Dragon Ball vs anything is a complete lack of care for character vs capability. Yeah, in this fight if it was allowed Vegeta could instantly fly up and blow up the area or the planet...but that's not something Vegeta would ever do unless he was backed in to a corner, thus it's a silly argument. Most of these things only work in fights where the whole bloodlust thing is on, the rest of the time basically the only character one can reason would act that way is Kid Buu given that the first thing he did was try to blow up Earth. |
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Definitely not a succubus, fear not | |
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